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    1. Kit: , by (VIP/Sponsor) JohnReid is offline
      Builder Last Online: Feb 2019 Show Printable Version Email this Page
      Model Scale: 1/8 Rating:  (4 votes - 4.50 average) Thanks: 0
      Started: 11-25-09 Build Revisions: Never  
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      Re: HMS Victory
      In my opinion,HMS Victory,by Noel CL Hackney is the best by far as a guide to the step by step rigging of this ship and other English ships-of-the-line.It was written by a modeler for other modelers .I have all the other books on modeling Victory but this little book, that I paid $1.98 for new in a hobby store 35 years ago ,is the best.Unfortunately they now only come up on the secondary market and only occasionally and they want up to $150.00 bucks for it.There are only 7 libraries in the world that stock it and there was only one printing made in the English language in 1970,the others are in German.If anyone knows how to put a little pressure on the owners of the rights to this book,please do so. Mr Hackney was foremost a modeler and he went to a lot of effort to make sure this information was available to modelers.I am sure that he would be very unhappy today to see the price that modelers have to pay and to whom the money is going.I am sure that in his lifetime it wasn't him.
      Check it out on the web ISBN 0 85059 053 1.

      I personally used his book over a 30 year period when building my own Victory and I don't think that I would have finished it as easily or as accurately as I did without it.It is a real shame that it will not be available to future modelers.And no I am not selling mine.
      Thanks Noel!
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  1. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Step 11 Mizzen Preventer Stay

    Hackney P62 Plate 10

    Longridge P222 Plan 6

    8 1/2 " rope ,rigged as for the mizzen stay but the loop around the mainmast is made a little more than halfway up the mast.The other end ties off to the eyebolt on the deck.
    Last edited by JohnReid; 12-21-09 at 06:35 PM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #32

  2. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Last edited by JohnReid; 12-10-09 at 02:28 PM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #33

  3. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    The solid lines going forward from the tops are the Fore,Main,Mizzen and Topmast stays.
    The dotted lines refer to a later stage.
    Last edited by JohnReid; 11-30-09 at 02:02 PM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #34

  4. hot ford coupe's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    When they were building those old ships way back when, I'd have loved to have the rope concession. I'd have made a fortune unless the ship builders did their own ropes.
    Sometimes a handful of patience is worth more than a truck load of brains. Have the courage to trust your own beliefs. Don't be swayed by those with louder voices. W.S. Maugham :)
    #35

  5. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Quote Originally Posted by crashnburn View Post
    Hi John, I'm working on the AL Victory after a heavy tool fell off a shelf and destroyed my Corel Victory at the early stages of rigging. I will be following this booklet closely, but the term 'snaking' has me a little confused. Are you referring to 'ratlines'?
    No the ratlines are the horizontal ropes on the shrouds. Snaking is the term used for tying the main and preventer stays together as a precaution against one or the other being shot away or failing for some reason or other.
    See Longridge P222 Fig151.
    Last edited by JohnReid; 11-30-09 at 01:56 PM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #36

  6. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Step 12 Jeer Blocks, Fore and Main.

    Hackney P62 Fig 41

    Longridge Fore yard P241 Plan 8

    Main yard P251

    Jeer blocks are three sheave and they hang just below the level of the tops by means of a 7" rope loop around the masthead turns.These turns made first,are of 4 1/2 " rope passed six times round the masthead and through the mast cleat on the opposite side from the block,so forming a strop.These cross front and rear of the masthead.The jeers on the mainmast are 28" and those on the foremast are 26".

    Last edited by JohnReid; 12-21-09 at 07:47 PM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #37

  7. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Step 13

    Jib Boom Horses

    Hackney P64 Fig 13.

    Longridge 227,234 Plan 6.

    Make a series of simple overhand knots in a length of 4" rope.Clove hitch the center of this around the outer end of the jib boom and tie the other two ends together around the jib boom behind the bowsprit cap.To look natural,allow the ropes to sag beneath the boom under their own weight .
    Last edited by JohnReid; 12-22-09 at 08:36 AM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #38

  8. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Step 14

    Topmast Pendants

    Hackney P 64 Fig 21

    Longridge I can't find a good reference for this step in Longridge.
    It is a single pendant of the type seen on the mizzen mast.
    I will however try to find a reference and post it here.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #39

  9. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Step 15

    Breast Backstays

    Hackney P64

    Longridge P231-32 Fig 162 (good drawing of the breast backstay purchase)


    These are fitted to the fore and main topmasts only,one each side, they are 7" rope with an eye going over the masthead and a 14" block tied into the lower end slightly above deck rail level.A 5" rope is tied to the base of the first deadeye on each channel except the mizzen ones,it runs through the block,and ties off to the base of the third deadeye on the fore channels and to the base of the second deadeye on the main channels.
    Last edited by JohnReid; 12-22-09 at 09:44 AM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #40

  10. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Deleted posts and drawings.
    I have deleted some posts here and on my photobucket .I have decided to use my pictures only.No drawings or other material will be used as this is available from other sources on the web.It is really only the sequence of rigging that is missing on the websites and besides my drawing are lousy.Thank you for your understanding ,I am kind of learning about what works and doesn't work as I go along too.
    Cheers! John. :)'
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #41

  11. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Step 16

    Fore Topmast Standing Backstay
    Hack P64
    Long P222


    Three each side,of 7" rope.



    ____________________
    Step 17

    Main Topmast Standing Backstay

    Hack P64
    Long P222

    Three each side of 7" rope belay to the foremost eye on the backstay stool.
    Last edited by JohnReid; 12-22-09 at 05:42 PM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #42

  12. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Last edited by JohnReid; 12-10-09 at 05:10 PM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #43

  13. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Please note:
    For large pics of the rigging please go to my photobucket.When on my main page scroll down the albums list on the port side.
    Click on "Victory book" and there you will find large and very large pictures , in approximately the right sequence for rigging Victory.Remember these pics are of a 1/72 scale model blown up to make your job of rigging easier.Color,scale,small flaws and mistakes will be embarrassingly obvious to the expert but at scale distance to the ordinary modeler it looks fine.Remember this is a diorama and I did use some artistic license for overall effect.Anyway that's my story and I'm sticking to it!
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #44

  14. JohnReid's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    The most important thing is the rigging sequence and that I can vouch for because when I finished I only had two pieces of running rigging that I couldn't place properly.I forget what they were now but because I no longer had access to the bottom of the mast I had to belay them to the shrouds.
    After I finish the sequence of rigging I plan to identify the belaying points on the ship for each step of the rigging process that I am showing here.I plan to identify them by keying them to each step that I am working on now.The actual run of the rigging is covered very well by Longridge but he like all the others(except Hackney) is very confusing on the step-by step sequence,In other words the "how to..." of how the rig the ship in the proper order, which in this case happens to be how the real ship was rigged by her riggers at the time.Luckily for us as modelers it also happens to be the best method to rig a model. If you are not careful you can very quickly loose access to critical areas in all the maze of rigging.As a general rule I never permanently belay anything down until thinking it though.Sometimes it is tempting to want to completely finish a step without really thinking about it.A good example would be the shrouds ,do not finish them with laniards and ratlines until the end of the rigging process.You can finish them individually but leave the laniards(the ropes between the deadeyes} loose.I don't know how many times I had to free them to get access to the running rigging belaying points at the foot of the masts.The ratlines you will have good access to until the end so there is no rush to finish them.
    It is very important to keep asking yourself "will I need future access to this area ?" and resist the temptation to "finish it " permanently.
    Last edited by JohnReid; 12-04-09 at 10:43 AM.
    For Large Pictures see:

    **************************************************
    https://albatros15.imgur.com/all/
    **************************************************
    My 1:16th dioramas are now on permanent display at the Canada Aviaion and Space Museum,in Ottawa,Canada.The apprailals for the museum were done by Shep Paine who valued them at between $15,000 and $25,000 (US) each.
    #45

  15. hot ford coupe's Avatar VIP/Sponsor
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    Jeffrey
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    I can't say enough how beautiful this ship model is. I thought to myself many times "how does John work his magic ?" I figured out the answer after reading this booklet. John does this one rope at a time. We're glad to have you with us, john.
    Sometimes a handful of patience is worth more than a truck load of brains. Have the courage to trust your own beliefs. Don't be swayed by those with louder voices. W.S. Maugham :)
    #46

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