The future of large scale kits

[Rick]

I just read a post on another forum that you may find interesting.

For years, one of the foremost model shows in the world has been the Tamiya -Con. Last year, and again this year, the show has been cancelled by Tamiya . Some folks are suggesting that the North American Tamiya market is in trouble. Its also being said that Tamiya is not listening to its grassroots customers, especially those who still want to "build" their models. Where have we heard that before? Revelle Monogram of course. When was the last time they answered one of your letters or came out with something new and acqurate?

Unfortunatly, Tamiya is following the lead of several other big name model companies and are selling much of their product "pre-built". Kits are being built in a third world country and then sold through Ebay and other sources. A perfect example of this practice is with the Amanti boat line. Some of their boat kits are being built in Vietnam and sold on the net. Nobody knows if other manufactures will follow, but it seems to be the trend with some of the big players.

How will this affect us? Who knows. I suspect that in the short term we'll be OK. There's still a good supply of stuff out there, just look at all the Pocher kits that keep showing up on Ebay. But, it looks like our supply of Tamiya Indy and FI kits may dry up in the next few years, unless you want a pre built-one. Who know's what will happen in the long term. Some folks will probably start buying hard to find kits now and hoarding them until they can double their money. Others will buy low and sell high on Ebay. Regardless, its going to be an interesting market to follow in comming years.

On the positive side, the cottage industry is growing rapidly and more parts are comming on the market. My wish is that those folks will create an industry that will satisfy our needs. We're already starting to see that in a small way with the proliferation of small scale parts and a huge variety of bodies. Its become its own industry, especially in the 1/24th and 25th market. The large scale crowd is slowly catching up with some pretty cool stuff and hopefully it won't be long before we'll have some new large scale bodies.

Who knows, perhaps some day we'll be able to support the hobby ourselves.

[miked.]

I have noticed in the last couple of years kit manufactures will announce what there going to release then not follow through. I believe Rick is right, if we want our hobby to survive it's up to us. We as a modeling community are going to have to make our known kits, parts, or anything else we may want to build. We are already doing this with bodies, and a variety of engines.

[Don Garrett]

I tend to agree with you both...that's one of the biggest reasons TDR was formed. The old timers will remember back to the day when there were no aftermarket parts...we had to make it if we wanted something different.

TDR is a small group of modelers and honestly it's much easier to do a one off whatever than it is to create a quality master for casting ...so it takes time.

On the bright side......we're here to help you young bucks that are willing to jump in and give it a try, after all..it's you folks that are the future of large scale modeling.

Perhaps some basic tutorials on casting or producing a master are in order?

[Bob Cline]

A couple of thoughts:

Don touched on the cost aspect - Who amongst us can afford the prices of the ever dwindling supply of Pocher kits? And not everyone wants to build (or pay for) the detail inherent in these kits? While you can get almost anything you want in the 1/24 aftermarket, who can afford to master a 1/8 body resin kit?

Certainly, this will limit participants in large scale to those with the means (read older) to complete even a $100 Deuce kit.

As for me, being 62, I'm hording what I think I might like to do in the next 10 years, or so, if I'm able. Although, cost aside, I'm getting to where I can scratch build a lot more than I thought possible only a year or 2 ago.

Since I can't afford to do everything I want in large scale, I've also come to terms with 1/24. I only do curbsides now, selecting less complicated subjects and doing only the detail that I feel is absolutely necessary.

On the plus side it seems to me that the nascent home CNC technology might be the answer in the cost equation. For those willing to endure the learing curve and to pay maybe the cost equivalent of mastering one body this technology could be yours.

I still appreciate the hand made aspect of this hobby but that discussion is probably left for another time.

[Don Garrett]

We're working on it Bob........Tim, Rick and our silent partner are doing a balancing act between New Tech and old school/hands on. Pixels and such are fast, accurate etc. but costly! Old School is labor intensive so time is an issue.

As far as seeing something totally new (large scale) from R/M.... Tamiya , Lindy...I gave up on that long ago. I really can't image the bean counters giving the go ahead on a niche market.

We really can't blame them, after all...they are in biz to be fat cats and there is more profit in selling loads of 1/25th stuff than there is in producing a large scale kit for way fewer sales. If you take the time to think about it...the newer 3 'n 1 Big T or Deuce is a hell of a bargain at under a hundred bucks. When you get right down to the core of it....that stuff was introduced by Monogram back in the day and other than additions to the old kits.............................................. ..get my drift?

[hot ford coupe]

A lot of very important points have been raised here and they're directly related to the health and welfare of sites like ours. The lack of parts, kits, tools and accessories as well as the vital need to spread the education needed to use those parts I.E. good modeling techniques and tips are the greatest reasons for our existence. It totally justifies our place in the hobby. We, now more than ever, not the manufacturers have become the spearhead for the advancement of the modeling hobby. If we truly want scale modeling to survive, and I know many of you guys are passionate about your building, it's up to each and every one of us to do whatever we can no matter what your level of skill may be. We all need to get involved in passing our knowledge to the less experienced and finding new ways to make what no one else dares to provide. ALL of you guys have much more to contribute than you actually think. From what I see on the site, every member can learn something new from every other member and beyond. I know you all have what it takes. This one's got to come from the grass roots or the trenches so to speak and that means us. If you want something, do it. If you're not sure how to, we've got plenty of folks here that are more than willing to help you out, no strings attached. If we wait for someone else to do something about it, our hobby has the same chance of survival as a snowman at the Equator. USAUSAUSA


Heck, I sound like I've been in the military too long. Well, even though I've taken a short break from building, I'm still as passionate about the hobby as I ever was.

[Rick]

I consider you to be one of the "Masters" around here Jeff. We can't wait for you to get back into your room and finish some of those scratchbuilt parts you started.

[htrdrnu]

I just wanted to touch on a subject that Don passed on to the forum, that is GSL. This is where the best modelers get together every 2 years not only to compete in a very friendly manner, but to also through seminars, pass on the skills and learning that a life time of building has acquired. To that end, we at the museum have dvd's of the past seminars that teach some of the very techniques that have been discussed here ie:Doing mini machining by Augie Hiscano, totally scratch building large scale models by Dave Cummins, just to name a few.

If you are interested and can make the journey, it will pay big dividends to come and become part of the longest running and absolutely the best model car contest and convention in the world!! No hype, just the gosh awful truth!!!

Brian

[Rick]

Thanks for that Brian. Is there a web site we should be looking at?

[xken]

This year the registration for the International Toy Fair in Nueremburg is down; the modelling group is down 25% overall Chinese involvement is down 45%. Tamiya has cancelled their premium show event. All in all the companies that supply all forms and scales of models are hurting; face it models generally are purchased with discretionary income. The price of gas and unemployment or under employment has wipe out that segment of income for most.

The next generation of modelling in being redefined with sterolithograpy and resin casting that does not require steel injection molds thus saves a tremendous amount of up front investment. This will evolve into a "cottage" industry of model supplies; which are currently on the rise.

3D Cad modelling is another off shoot of modelling that only requires computers, software and knowledge, a great example of this is Mark Miller's work. This technology is every evolving as well with web sites dedicated to computer flying in "models" that replicate actual traits of the real aircraft.

All are great directions and should be appreciated by us all. As for me this "old dog" still tries to learn something new everyday. Just keep on modelling in whatever technique works for you.

As for me I am pretty much a scratch builder because of disappoinrment of the commercial kits quality of detail or subjects I wanted to build was not available or not in the scale I wanted. So rather than whine I taught myself scratch building mostly in brass and wood doing WWI planes and helicopters; which were both personal lifelong intersts.

As for the future of modelling; it has been around since the Egyptians built the pyramids and will still be going on long after we are all gone as long as there are those like us who have the passion to build.

Ken

[hot ford coupe]

Thanks Rick for the great vote of confidence. You made me blush. Tonight, the wife and I started cleaning up and restocking the old workshop. Tomorrow, the bench gets the treatment.

Not to gush, but I must give credit for my education to a lot of other great modelers who gave me the advice and encouragement. Without them, I wouldn't have gone out of my comfort zone and tried some of the things I never thought I could do I hesitate to name anyone for fear that I might forget someone. That would be the biggest faux pa of all.

Ken, I got into scratch building pretty much for the same reason you did. There were only 2 large scale kits available and you can only build just so many box stock . When I saw what was being done on this site, I was knocked off my hobby chair. The challenge was just too irresistable.

[htrdrnu]

Rick,
The Site is www.gslchampionship.org/. You can see all about this years and go back to see results of others.

Brian

[SVtrackhead]

Kits are being built in a third world country and then sold through Ebay and other sources. A perfect example of this practice is with the Amanti boat line. Some of their boat kits are being built in Vietnam and sold on the net.

Just to clarify: the Vietnam-built boats seen on ebay and elsewhere online are not built from existing kits. They are knock-offs; well done for the price but not as accurate as the kits they copy, and usually in a slightly different scale (to avoid legal issues I assume).