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xken
11-07-14, 01:52 PM
I am starting on an 1895 hearse as a line extension for the horse drawn vehicles for Model Expo. Here is the CAD file so far and I will be starting in wood soon. Having moved from Ohio to California I am still trying to find certain items that were packed but have not been found so far. However, the weather here is much better than Ohio (no snow or leaves to rake).


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Ken

BrassBuilder
11-08-14, 10:56 AM
Ken,
How did you pick up CAD drawing so fast? Those drawings look like they have some pretty intricate design elements. It wasn't too long ago you were still using your old CAD system...Cardboard Aided Design.
Mike

xken
11-08-14, 11:17 AM
Mike, necessity is the mother of invention and being a designer ( BFA Industrial Design) the package was provided to me at no cost if I learned it so with a friends basic instruction and stumbling along on my own I am still learning it. Also God has blessed me with the ability to learn anything quickly; now I am sure that every professional CAD instructor would go nuts if they saw the way I do it. I never look at the command line and draw intuitively using the command short cuts.

VintageModMan
11-14-14, 03:00 PM
Ken I'm very very interested in this piece of modeling art/craftsmanship and your use of Auto CAD drawing. I really need to learn more in Auto CAD Ken. Also I draw the same way and would have the same looks by most CAD instructors too...lol

May I ask what CAD brand you use? Ive tried Auto Desk and Solid Works.

Great Work Ken and I've admired your work always
Gary

xken
11-14-14, 06:31 PM
Gary thank for you kind words on my work. I use CorelCAD which is both 2D and 3D however, I only use the 2D for the parts and drawing. Google CorelCAD and look at some of the tutorial videos.
Have a great day!
Ken

xken
11-16-14, 10:29 AM
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Started to build with wood here are the basic parts to start with. The sides are 1/16" basswood and the inside piece is slighty smaller in the center to provide the window recess. The rectanglar openings in the floor are for the coffin rollers.

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Here are the parts in various stages of finish. The floor was painted black prior to adding the walls.

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Here the sides are in place and the adding of the driver's seat. I am using the door cut outs as masks for painting.

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Here are the bracing for the driver's foot rest. The thin section is 1/16" and tricky cutting with the xacto knife. Once it was cut out I reinforced it with CA to avoid breaking off while adding the rest of the parts.

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Here is the painted assembly and you can see the uppainted recess for the windows.


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Here is a closeup, the curved pieces are 1/32" basswood cut using the grain of the wood for easy forming.

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Here is the plain wooden pine box coffin requested by the client. The lid is removable to store your candy.gringrin I have been building and doing the CAD drawings simultaniously to provide the Laser files to Model Expo and while waiting for them I will move on to the brass parts.

xken
11-16-14, 10:38 AM
Not sure how the last picture got posted, but since it is there this just shows using filler to smooth the edges. The laser cut edges will have a slight angle and this picture will be in the instruction to show how to address the joints.

KURTVD19
11-19-14, 02:18 PM
Ken:
The build looks great. I bet the piece by the drivers foot rest is going to get broken by many builders regardless of how many warnings are put in the instructions. No way around it though. See it all the time with thin sections of ships frames near where the grain is weakest by the thinner areas. How about suggesting that the reinforcing piece be glued in place even before the parts are taken out of the carrier sheet? Small laser marks for the reinforcement with the parts oriented so that the pieces are both attached to the top side of the sheet?
Kurt

xken
11-19-14, 02:41 PM
Kurt,
Thanks for the suggestion, what I did on the laser cut was to orient the part so that the thinner sections are in line with the wood grain. I also suggest that the parts be strengthened with CA as soon as removed from the parent sheet. The one thing about advice is that it does not have to be taken.
I have found door hinges at the local dollhouse store which were perfect for the herase. 1/4" high. Here are pictures of the doors in place.

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How is the Allerton build coming along?
Ken

xken
12-01-14, 12:19 PM
Moved onto working with some brass for the suspension. Here is the start of the front suspension with the axle and springs. The fifth wheel will use wooden parts which I am waiting for from Model Expo. The axles have a hexagon section in the center between the mounting points.
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Here is the rear suspension alomost finished. This is an interesting semi eliptical concept that probably distributed the weight more evenly.
Nuts have not being added yet and on the left you can see the locating point for the axles which are the same front and rear.
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Now to finish up the nuts for the rear then back to the front suspension and make the wood parts myself.

KURTVD19
12-03-14, 11:29 AM
Ken:
That's a very elaborate suspension system - especially when the passenger isn't concerned about a smooth ride.
Kurt

xken
12-03-14, 05:12 PM
Kurt,
You are correct; the other interesting thing is that there are no brakes so it must be slow and level rides.
Ken

xken
12-04-14, 12:05 PM
I moved forward to the front suspension assembly which required some interesting intergation of wood frame members reinforced with metal parts and alignment of the central pivot poinr for the front axle.

Here is a sequence showing how I soldered together the parts after they were fabricated. The real nesscessity that is needed in soldering parts with proximity to wood parts is a really hot iron to transfer heat instantly. Again I am using a 120 watt Weller soldering iron even with these small parts and joints.

Here all the parts are assembled together and held in place with rubber bands. All the parts are indexed on a 1/16" aluminum tube. In this confoguration I soldered the top and bottom brass rings turned on the lathe and 1/16" thick. I gathered a drop of Staybrite solder on the very tip of the iron and touched one side and held for good flow and removed the iron as quickly as possible and then with a Q-tip (cotton bud) weted with acetone to cool the joint quickly to minimize the burn on the wood. I then repeated for the other side of the ring. Solder does not stick to aluminum.


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I then broke down the assembly and then added the center rings with the wood parts in place and using the aluminum tube for alignment.
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You can see that I used aligator clips to hold the parts in place while being soldered.
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This shows the finished soldered parts with the center pivot rings that were also turned on the lathe that are 1/8" diameter by 7/32" high. No burnt wood, quickness and chilling with the acetone keeps damage to the wood parts to a minimum.
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Here are all the parts dissassembled and cleaned up. The hotter the iron the better the molten solder transfer to the brass joints and less joint clean up needed.

Here are the parts in place now using a Square headed turned bolt 1-1/8" long and threaded with 0-80 threads and using a hex bolt for now to hold together. The upper member is press fitted into two holes on the hearse frame. This is still a work in progress with more parts to be added yet.
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KURTVD19
12-05-14, 11:39 AM
Ken:
Great work. This sure is an intricate and pretty complex assembly.

I can appreciate the difficulty of soldering with the part in contact with wood. I have started to use a resistance soldering unit and find that it works great with Stay-brite w/o charring the wood. Also found that the Weller iron with the rotary dial power adjustment is a great improvement over the ordinary soldering iron but since getting the resistance unit I tend to use the Weller unit less than before.
Kurt

Egon
12-05-14, 06:28 PM
Ken is there any connection to a French builder with that rear suspension perhaps Citroen he1he

xken
12-05-14, 10:25 PM
Egon, not sure but here is a photo of the real deal, I think this setup offerwed a smoother ride given the fact they did not have shock absorbers and perhaps less lateral movement. But this is where Citroen engineers started.
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xken
12-07-14, 11:02 AM
Kurt,
Which resistance unit did you get and use?

Ken

xken
12-08-14, 08:02 PM
I made the two U brackets and filed the D shapes on each side for the clamps with indexing holes for the front and rear bars.bars
I moved onto the front axle stabilizer bars. First I cut two 1/8" rods to 2-1/4" long; then one end I cit a 3/64" locating pin and next a taper cut to a 1 degree taper and then annealed.
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Once annealed they were bent to a 90 degree curve at the thick end. The objective is to eventually match the ends to the holes in the brackets on the wood hitch sides.

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Once both were bent, they were then hammered to a tapered flat about half way down. Next I formed a counter bend. I marked the next bend point to be in line with the bracket hole and then made a sharp bend and hammered flat the end using the edge of the steel square for a tight inside edge.

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The ends were then drilled and a 3/64" locating pin was soldered into each. Each end was then slightly bent to adjust for the different heights.

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Once satisfied with the fits I then soldered both in place and then formed the two rear bars.

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Here is the assembly removed from the pivot bolt to better see the unit. Next I will make the four (4) spring clamps.

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These were interesting parts to form with a bit of a challenge to mate to the pins to the holes and solder.

xken
12-09-14, 09:51 PM
Here are the front suspension parts cleaned up of excess solder at the joints. Now to move on to making the spring clamps; four in total and a few other smaller parts to finish out the front.

Side view.
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Front view with the aluminum wheel hubs in place.

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xken
12-11-14, 12:35 PM
There are two different styles of spring shackles that hold the springs in place. The first set was pretty straight forward that held the matal axle to the spring, however the second set required a little "hand forging". I made a test part to verify the size and dimension and once sorted out four more were made.

Here is the test shackle and a series showing the fabricating them. You can see in the background the metal axle shackles that were fairly simple.
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Four 1/16" square rods had each end turned down 3/64" to simulate the threaded end. These shackles will be used as casting patterns so the threaded ends will be 1/16" longer for casting sprues.

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Once turned all were annealed (heated red hot and quenched in water) to soften the brass for forming. The first step was to hammer a recess using a 1/8" drill bit shank to a thickness of 1/32" resting the rod on a steel block next to the edge of the block to allow finger clearance and hold the drill bit level.

Next working from each end to the center using a 5/16" drift punch the center portion was flattened to match the recesses using the least amount of hammer blows. Hammering is now work hardening the metal.
Once satisfied with the even thickness using the drift punch then straighten, file an smooth and even the edges.


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Next all are annealed again to soften from the hammering and formed around a 1/8" drill bit shank held in a panavise. Before bending mark the center point with a pencil to use as a guide centered on the shank to keep each leg the same size. Once satisfied with the fit on the axle file the edge in the bend area, the flat surface will cup during the bending process.

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Here is the assembly with the shacles in place and cleaned up. Keep in mind the threaded ends are longer than they will be on the cast parts.


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Next the retaining plate is fabricated from a 1/16" thick sheet stock. The holes locations are determined by the top of the part and the threaded ends adjusted as needed.

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Once the first plate is made and tested I then glued it with CA to bar stock that has be filed flat and then the holes drilled to match. Next the edges were filed to match so the parts are identical. I then used a hot soldering iron to separate the two from each other and cleaned the off the excess dried glue.

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Even though I am working on a hearse these techniques can be easily adapted to car parts as well.

KURTVD19
12-11-14, 08:31 PM
Ken:
Fabulous work. Lining up the bent parts of the front steering assembly so they match up to each other and meet the holes so they can be soldered in place is much easier for you to describe than to actually do I am sure.

You asked about the resistance soldering unit I picked up. It is the Micro Mark Model #85522. It has only a high or low setting but I haven't found this to be a problem yet. I picked it up to see if it would work with what I am doing now and so far so good. The other ones they carry are much more expensive - double and up - and are by American Beauty. I usually advocate buying the best but in this case I decided that I would work with the lesser unit to see if I needed one of the much more expensive units and if I wind up needed one of these I will offer this one to a club member at a good discount.
As you suggested I will post some photos of building the kit of the 1869 Steam Pumper to that build later tonight.
Kurt

xken
12-13-14, 04:04 PM
I have finished up the front suspension with nuts and bolts, D-rings; as well as, the grab handles.
Here is an in progress grab handle; the handles were turned on a lathe then a 1/16" rod was formed with flanges hammered on the ends for holes to accept the handle ends and nuts with a locating pin.

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Here are the D-rings which on the real hearse have leather belts in them to limit the travel of the hitch. These were sawed out of 1/16" sheet stock the the shank was turned on the lathe. Holes were then drilled to accept the shanks.

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Here aree some overall on which you can also see the round headed bolts and nuts on the ends of the springs and grab handles.


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Next onto the coffin and seat rails.

5thwheel
12-14-14, 12:23 PM
Ken,
Your metal work is outstanding. Coming from the early days of ferris metals in SMHDV I am quickly coming around to brass. You make it look easy.

I have been away from the forum a while because of a computer crash, new I pad and stuff like that. I had forgotten my user name and pass word; it was really hard to get back on with all the hoops to jump through; make one mistake and start all over. It is fun getting caught up. This hearse looks like a promising kit. I'm happy to be able to follow your work again.

Bill

xken
12-16-14, 01:25 PM
Bill,
Glad to hear you are back; having recently moved from Ohio to California I know what it is like.
Here are a couple of pictures od seat rail and coffin rails.
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The round portions of the rail stantions are bumpers to protect the coffin if it drifts from side to side.
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Next will be the two door latches that I would like to make functional.

xken
12-18-14, 12:14 PM
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Making the second latch for the front door; here is the rear door latch and its components.
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The latches are functional and will work. The center round part is a bushing that is the thickness of the wood with an I.D. sized the match the square shank on the handle.

I then added the lanterns and whip holder. If they look familiar they are the same as the Allerton.
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Here is a closeup. Many of the auxilery cast parts will have a "Brass" finish using the Krylon Gold Foil paint.

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The laser cut parts have arrived and after finishing the second latch and seat cushion I will build the wheels.

Tony
12-18-14, 03:50 PM
Love your brass work, great to see you addiction to the yellow stuff is still alive and well

KURTVD19
12-23-14, 08:00 PM
Ken:
Very interesting build. Love the working door handles. The front suspension/steering assembly is remarkable.
Merry Christmas.
Take care,
Kurt

xken
12-24-14, 03:44 PM
Received the first round laser parts and spent time assembling them; photographing the steps and started the assembly instructions and will go as far as I can until I need the cast parts.
Here are the two side by side.

Merry Christmas to all!

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KURTVD19
12-25-14, 01:49 PM
Ken:
How did you do up the curved piece under the driver's legs for the production kit? Just a thin piece or laser cuts on the back side? Looking good.
Merry Christmas,
Kurt

xken
12-26-14, 12:24 PM
Kurt,
It is a piece of 1/32" basswood cut with the wood grain going horizontal to be easier to bend. It could also be 1/64" plywood; the final production choice is made by Model Expo. The same is for the piece behind the seat. The long skinny section of the side wall pieces are also "oriented" with the wood grain for strength. I usually look at what I consider "tricky" parts that need idiot proofing and orient them with the wood grain as needed.

KURTVD19
12-28-14, 10:45 AM
Ken:
I remember you saying how the parts would be oriented earlier in the build. Thanks for the clarification.
Kurt

5thwheel
01-18-15, 11:51 PM
What is happening with the hearse? Any more forward progress?

Bill

xken
01-19-15, 02:13 PM
I have been working on various drawings and cleaning parts prior to shipping them off to be cast. I am also waiting for laser cut parts, Model Expo has a new person who is slowly being brought up to speed so I am just waiting for things to happen. Here is a PDF image of the in progress perspective drawing.

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xken
01-29-15, 08:11 PM
Close to finishing up the perspective exploded parts view. I have not drawn a few of the non essental parts for clarity sake. These kind of drawings just take time and focus to draw. This will be a 34" wide x 22" high plan page in the kit along other more typical elevation views. I am really starting to get the hang of drawing 2D; once there is no pressing projects I may explore the 3D features of the program.

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KURTVD19
01-30-15, 01:11 PM
Ken:
The drawing is great. I like the exploded perspective views. They can clarify items that just are not seen well in the std 3 views of most plans.
What program are you using? I think you might have mentioned it once before but I forgot.
Kurt

xken
01-30-15, 01:42 PM
Kurt,
I am using CorelCAD. A cost effective alternative to AutoCAD. It has both 2D and 3D. I have not really tried the 3D since clients only need 2D.
Goggle "CorelCAD Tutorials" and you can get a good feel for the program.

KURTVD19
01-30-15, 07:55 PM
Ken:
I will look at it. Have to do something in the way of CAD - just have to pick one within the budget and then sit down and learn it.
Thanks,
Kurt

KURTVD19
02-23-15, 07:49 PM
Ken:
I picked up Corel Draw Suite and Corel CAD. I have the need to import a scanned historic ship plan drawing and then convert it to a CAD drawing and a buddy who odes this said that Corel Draw is the best way to import a drawing and then to "trace" it in Corel Draw making a digital file that can be used in Corel CAD to make a final CAD drawing with all the changes and additional views.
I will need to devote the time to learn both programs so I can do this and right now isn't the right time with the NRG stuff consuming most of my time - haven't been able to spend more than two hours over the last month on a model and I have 3 projects on hold now.
My son went back to school so I was able to get both of these programs at the student rate - I could not have justified paying the full price.
When I get around to using the CAD I will share a sample of my work with you.
Take care,
Kurt

xken
02-23-15, 11:27 PM
Kurt,
Yes I have heard of this technique before but have no experience in doing it. Let me know how it works out. The academic version price is great, however I think some of the features are turned off that are available in the professional version. I really enjoy doing the exploded views in perspective being able to move the vanishing point reference lines to keep everything correct.
Sounds like you are busier than a one-armed paperhanger; just remember it is better to be busy than bored. he1he

Egon
10-07-15, 12:52 PM
Ready for a new project ? Duke of Wellingtons hearse, a monster, sides casted in bronze from old cannons.

xken
03-31-19, 12:03 AM
The Hearse was finally completed after a two year hiatus of being on hold. Everything has been sent to M.E. for production. I have no idea of when it will be introduced, that is their call.They have also kept me busy doing ship kits as well. I am wanting to get back to building a car project and have one in mind but may take a while to do since other paying projects get in the way.


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Jo NZ
03-31-19, 03:44 AM
We need you making cars, Ken...