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JohnReid
06-05-08, 03:09 PM
Here is a Victory diorama I built awhile ago. Small scale but large in size.http://www.scalemotorcars.com/forum/images/imported/2008/05/75.jpg1gramps1

JCote
06-06-08, 03:08 AM
You're a real all-rounder John, excelling everywhere.

hot ford coupe
06-06-08, 03:21 AM
That's a ditto for me. I'm still watching his dio thread. 1thumbup1

JohnReid
06-06-08, 01:13 PM
Thanks guys!If it is OK ,(as I know this site is for large scale only) I could put up other pics of this build.As a suggestion maybe the admin here would consider opening a page for dioramas.1gramps1
You know they really are the hot thing in modeling today compared to when I started 10 years ago when most modelers thought a diorama was a nice base!

hot ford coupe
06-06-08, 03:30 PM
If we put up a dio thread, we would need some tutorials to show many of us how to make them. So far, I know of two members who have been strong dio makers. One is Keith Scoviak (88proof) and the other is you John. there may be others but I don't remember who they are. (Sorry). With a bunch of tuts, it may stir some more builders to go in that direction. I wouldn't mind putting some dio elements into my aircraft builds. Dan, what do you think? It's your decision.

JohnReid
06-06-08, 08:14 PM
I really like this site because of the high quality of the builds shown here.Dioramas tend to add a little art to the craft side of modelbuilding.Telling or suggesting stories adds a whole new element to our hobby and helps to make it come alive.They also personalize your work and can be very creative.Cheers! John.1thumbup1

hot ford coupe
06-07-08, 01:14 AM
Hey John, the story is exactly what Ken Hamilton spoke about in his book on small scale dios. Just a bunch of things placed around a particular model doesn't cut it. He said something like you should be able to look at a dio and read the whole thing right there. Any help on how to develop a story and express that would be greatly appreciated.

JohnReid
06-07-08, 10:17 AM
I have written quite about this in the past on other threads.Ken and I converse regularly and are really on the same wavelength about dioramas.Another great book is by Shep Paine who I guess you could call the father of the modern diorama.
When I do my online book I plan to bring a lot of this together but in the meantime I will post some of it here on the Vintage thread.
Cheers! John.1gramps1

hot ford coupe
06-07-08, 12:36 PM
That's great, John. The more info we can get, the better. I'm glad to see that you know Ken Hamilton well. I've got his book and I'm learning quite a bit from both you guys. Thanks so much for the help.

DonnyW
10-05-08, 11:38 AM
Although I have seen it before..I never tire of looking at your photos of the Victory. I made two tall ships around the same time as you made this one..but I have no figures in mine. Thanks for showing it 1yeah1

JohnReid
11-22-09, 09:53 PM
Rather than just posting a bunch of pics of the Victory I will start a little thing on dioramas and how I go about building them.I have only built one ship diorama but many things apply to all dioramas such as painting and modifying figures for example or weathering etc...
I guess the best place to start is at the beginning. so.........1gramps1

JohnReid
11-22-09, 09:55 PM
What is a diorama?
Traditionally a diorama was a shadow box or three-dimensional picture,however in our modern era it has come to encompass just about anything where objects are positioned in such a way as to interrelate with each other and usually tell or suggest a story.The key is that it must be three dimensional.The setting can be very realistic or fanciful depending upon your own imagination.The magic of the diorama is that it takes a somewhat static object or group of objects and makes them come alive.In my mind it takes the craft of modelling and elevates it into the realm of art.I think that it is the highest expression of what we do as modellers.The whole craft vs art controvery just slips away and becomes irrelevent and even the kit vs scratch dilemma really doesnt matter because now the focus is on your creative ability to raise an emotional response in your viewer. Let your imagination run wild,contact that 10 year old kid that exists in all of us and you cant help but be a successful dioramist.Cheers! John

JohnReid
11-22-09, 09:57 PM
Best book?
I think that Shep Paine is probably the modern day master of the diorama.
His book "How to build dioramas " belongs on every modelers bookshelf or preferably their workbench.It is not expensive and is readily available. I will mention other books later but this is the best place to start especially for the basics.
Dioramas are not hard to do but they do change the focus a bit from pure model building to storytelling, using your own models.

JohnReid
11-22-09, 09:58 PM
Another great book along the same lines is "How to build car dioramas" by my modeling bud Ken Hamilton.It is out of print now but he has given me permission to use it for teaching purposes.Many marine diorama scenes could include harbors or docks that could contain any number of things worth building other than just the ship model.Wharves,sheds,figures,barn siding,bricks and masonry walls etc...etc..whatever your imagination can come up with. That is the fascinating thing about diorama making it can encompass such a wide variety of subjects and modeling techniques.

JohnReid
11-22-09, 10:01 PM
Well I guess we will start with modifying and painting figures.Ken Hamilton came up with a very good diagram of how to do this.In this case a pic is worth a thousand words.His book is out of print and he has personally cleared me to use it for teaching purposes.

JohnReid
11-22-09, 10:07 PM
http://www.scalemotorcars.com/forum/images/imported/2009/11/78.jpg

JohnReid
11-22-09, 10:09 PM
If you want to put figures on your diorama there are a few decisions that will have to be made early on.Will you be scratch building or modifying pre-made figures or something in between?If your building figures from scratch then any scale that you feel comfortable with is OK.But if your like most of the rest of us you will be modifying figures to suit your needs.There are a lot of great figures out there now but not in all scales.Take a look at great models.com, they have a lot of figures in many scales.There are more and more all the time and I know if ship modelers were using them they would manufacture them if the demand was there.Right now the armour guys have the greatest variety in 1/35 scale because they have been into dioramas for a long time.The airplane guys building in 1/32 scale will sometimes use the armour stuff when they can.Different manufactures do differ a bit so measure them yourself and you may be surprised. Also remember humans,animals and even tools vary in size in real life 1:1 scale.
I received the Model Expo catalog the other day and was thinking about this thread.There are a few great possibilities.My choice right now would be HMS Vanguard in 1/72 scale.If I had a few thousand extra hours to devout to it ,it would make for a great storyboard diorama either waterline or free standing.There are lots of 1/72 figures available in Napoleonic uniform which could easily be modified to crew the ship.You have a choice to of bare poles,harbor or full sail rig in calm or stormy seas.
There are other choices too.1/48,1/32,1/24 and even HO for the RR guys and even my current scale 1/16th.Numerous figures are available for all of these. to be cont.......

JohnReid
11-22-09, 10:11 PM
Now that we have decided on a scale and have good access to lots of figures we can move on.
Usually the larger the figure the easier it is to modify but not always.The Napoleonic figures that I used really didn't need a lot of modification, mostly the cutting off of unwanted items of uniform and some re-positioning of heads and limbs.(See Ken's diagram).The same figures that I used on Victory could be used on Vanguard .They are 1/72 scale and very well made.You will have to get familiar with using an xacto knife # 11 blade though ,as sanding only creates a rough and fuzzy surface which is very hard to paint. In fact in some ways a tooled surface looks even better and more like you would expect if your figures were scratch made from wood.I will post a few pics of the figures i used. to be cont........Comments or questions?

JohnReid
11-22-09, 10:14 PM
http://www.scalemotorcars.com/forum/images/imported/2009/11/79.jpg

JohnReid
11-22-09, 10:16 PM
These are the five different sets I used and in some cases only one or two of the figures from a set.The seated figures are great for oarsmen etc...all except the civil war set are in period uniforms.Even the civil war guys came in handy with a few modifications.

JohnReid
11-23-09, 11:30 AM
http://www.scalemotorcars.com/forum/images/imported/2009/11/80.jpg

JohnReid
11-23-09, 02:45 PM
In my opinion,HMS Victory,by Noel CL Hackney is the best by far as a guide to the step by step rigging of this ship and other English ships-of-the-line.It was written by a modeler for other modelers .I have all the other books on modeling Victory but this little book, that I paid $1.98 for new in a hobby store 35 years ago ,is the best.Unfortunately they now only come up on the secondary market and only occasionally and they want up to $150.00 bucks for it.There are only 7 libraries in the world that stock it and there was only one printing made in the English language in 1970,the others are in German.If anyone knows how to put a little pressure on the owners of the rights to this book,please do so. Mr Hackney was foremost a modeler and he went to a lot of effort to make sure this information was available to modelers.I am sure that he would be very unhappy today to see the price that modelers have to pay and to whom the money is going.I am sure that in his lifetime it wasn't him.
Check it out on the web ISBN 0 85059 053 1.

I personally used his book over a 30 year period when building my own Victory and I don't think that I would have finished it as easily or as accurately as I did without it.It is a real shame that it will not be available to future modelers.And no I am not selling mine.
Thanks Noel!

JohnReid
12-04-09, 07:24 PM
http://www.scalemotorcars.com/forum/images/imported/2009/12/13.jpg